MY HUSBAND IS A CERTIFIED GEMOLOGIST APPRAISER IN AN UPSCALE JEWELRY STORE IN SC. THE STORE CARRIES HEARTS ON FIRE DIAMONDS AS WELL AS OTHER BRANDS. HEARTS ON FIRE FAR OUTSELLS ANY OTHER DIAMOND IN THEIR STORE. THEY ARE WITHOUT A DOUBT THE MOST BEAUTIFUL "PERFECT" DIAMOND. THE COLOR MIGHT BE AN I COLOR BUT EVEN WHEN A DIAMOND OF A DIFFERENT BRAND & A"H" COLOR THE HEARTS ON FIRE LOOKS BETTER, RICHER, & BRIGHTER. MY NEXT DIAMOND IS TO BE A HEARTS ON FIRE. NO OTHER DIAMOND CAN COMPARE.

I'd have to see a HoF diamond side-by-side next to an Ideal Cut to be convinced. And even if I did, most of us don't walk around with a spare diamond in our pocket to whip out should someone randomly question whether or not the diamond I wear truly is HoF. I recently got engaged, and my future husband confessed he got a great deal on Blue Nile. I was completely blown away by the sparkle and fire of the diamond. I'm no gemologist, but I do know a thing or two about the importance of the cut of a diamond. While each uncut stone has its own unique flaws (unless flawless), the diamond cutter should cut the stone to make that flaw the least visible from the top. Whether the cut is HoF doesn't matter, as long as the cut is ideal for that particular stone. It's a shame people get taken in by the name. After all,to paraphrase Shakespeare, a rose by any other name is still a rose...

Carmen -
good question. I was at a HOF jeweler yesterday, and we ran through a lot of tests to see if the brand name is worth the price. One such test involved placing a HOF diamond next to another ideal cut diamond of the same clarity and color grade. What our salesman pointed out to me which made a lot of sense was to look at both diamonds in a stationary position as well as that in a moving position. In the Non-Stationary, the non-HOF diamond looked great, with different reds, greens, blues and all of the fire coming back from the diamond. In fact, at this distance, they looked identical. However, when remaining still, the HOF diamond still had a lot more fire than the non-HOF. While stationary, the non-HOF had a lot of white light being reflected, as opposed to multiple colors.

If you got a great deal, that's extremely important. For my purchase, I opted to spend more for 2 reasons: 1) The test I mentioned above, and 2) you are definitely spending more money for the brand name. This can be a good thing. If you ever try to sell this diamond back, you have a certain level of quality associated with it.
For example, if you're going to sell me a Craftsman wrench, because I know those products last forever and have a lifetime warranty, I will buy that from you at a higher price than Wrenchman wrench.

just one buyer's 2 cents.

Yall I was at an upscale jewelry store yesterday and I saw a HoF ring that literally stole my breath. It was over 5 carats! And it was surrounded by pave diamonds, all around and the side of the ring. The price?? $198,000! There was another ring that was over 7 carats but not a HoF ring. The price on that one? $189,000! I still can't get the brilliance of that HoF ring out of my mind!

My wedding ring is HOF. All I know is everywhere I go I am constantly complimented by women. My ring is very simple, but never stops "dancing". I also have a cross pendant and am looking to purchase some HOF stud earrings.

yes hof diamonds are the worlds most perfectly cut diamonds. They are the only company cutting their diamonds at 100 power magnification (using a NASA develpoed telescope),that means the hof diamond's perfect proportions, symmetry, and polish is graded at a level ten times higher then the industry standard. The are the only company with a vibration free cutting environment, which means they are able to acheive a much higher luster than any other diamond. Diamonds that are given an Ideal cut grade are pretty diamonds too, but they are not the best. There are 15,000 possible angles a diamond can have and still fall in the ideal catergory, hof hits the "sweet spot" on every single angle. When you see angles on an AGS certificate, they are actually averages, hof make sure that every angle hits the "sweet spot" not just the overall average. They had to prove their claim of having a perfectly cut diamond to the FTC and they won! why isnt any other diamond company saying they have a perfectly cut diamond? because they can't!

The very first time my boyfriend and I went ring shopping, the dealer introduced us the HOF diamond. Even though we both loved the HOF ring and very impressed with the sparkle we were blown away by the price - we thought we should shop around and look for a less expensive but comparable diamond engagement ring.

Two weeks later my boyfriend and I went ring shopping. After going from dealer to dealer and looking at brilliant to ideal cut rings, we finally went back to the HOF dealer almost disgusted with the car saleman like pitches thrown at us. The rings at the other dealers like Kay Jewelers (Leo) JB Robinson, Zales, etc were all comparable with each other - BUT when we say the HOF ring again there was absolutely no comparison. Needless to say, we agreed on the HOF for my ring.

Andrea,

Nice sales pitch!

Do you work for HOF and/or sell their merchandise? ;-) :-)

Your little fluff piece aside, it is common knowledge both in the diamond industry, as well as amongst today's savvy diamond shoppers, that the HOF diamonds are beautiful albeit typical Ideal Cut Diamonds.

They are no better and no worse than any other beautiful, TRUE Ideal Cut Diamond being sold for far less money, without the "brand name label".

Quite frankly, they are also MOST CERTAINLY NOT the best (most brilliant) and most precisely cut diamonds that one could buy...and for far less money.

Insofar as your "proof" of the HOF brand being the "best", since only they have the cojones to call their diamonds the "World's Most Perfectly Cut Diamonds"......with all due respect, this is one of the most ridiculous assertions I have heard in a very long time.

Quite simply, the reason no other company makes a similar claim, is because it is a trademarked (and fiercely protected) term used by Hearts on Fire.

Based on your posting,....;-) I am sure you are well aware of the fact that HOF will aggressively pursue legal action against any other company using an even remotely similar slogan/claim to their trademarked "Most Perfectly Cut Diamond" term.

In fact, many a colleague of ours has been on the receiving end of a lawyers letter from HOF, threatening legal action for using a similar term that might be "confused" with their trademarked slogan.

Of course, this is the reason other diamond sellers/manufacturers do not make a "similar claim" to selling/cutting the "World's Most Perfect Diamond" and not because they "cannot".

Nobody here is debating whether or not the Hearts on Fire Diamonds are beautiful and quality diamonds. They are and they are!

There is an accepted standard for a true Ideal Cut Diamond (the AGS-0 Ideal, or GIA EX/EX Excellent Cut Designation).

Hearts on Fire does not have a patent on cutting diamonds to this standard. Any company can cut an Ideal Cut Diamond for maximum beauty and precision cut.

Indeed, many companies and diamond manufacturers do just that,....and for a fraction of the selling price of any comparable HOF Diamond.

Again, I will say what I have said before on this thread and elsewhere; are HOF diamonds beautiful?

The answer is YES!

Are they EXCLUSIVELY IDEAL/Beautiful.....or "the best"??

The answer is, emphatically- NO, they are not.

In today's marketplace, with the quality of the ideal cut diamonds being sold everyday, the above answer is just as FACTUAL, ACCURATE, VERIFIABLE AND SALIENT as the ACCURATE AND VERIFIABLE FACT that the Hearts on Fire Diamonds Brand carries a significant dollar premium over any other comparable diamond without the label.

Thanks for your point of view.

Regards,

Marie,

Thanks very much for sharing your experience.
Enjoy your beautiful Hearts on Fire diamond ring in health and happiness!

However, when you mention your comparison shopping to the other jewelers like Kay, Zales etc.. who have a notorious and well deserved reputation for selling inferior quality diamonds; I have to ask whether you were indeed comparing "apples to apples"..

Are you sure that the diamonds you were being shown at KAY, Zales..etc.. mall stores, were TRUE Ideal Cut Diamonds and not just diamond rings that were given "Ideal" designations by the people behind the counter in the stores??

Who said these diamonds were Ideal Cut Diamonds? Were they actually graded as being Ideally cut by either the GIA or AGS labs??

Did you see this Ideal/Excellent Cut Designation on the Independent Grading report from either the GIA or AGS (AGS-0 Ideal, or GIA EX/EX with Excellent Cut Parameters)??

Who graded these diamonds?

The reason I ask, is simply because a TRUE Ideal Cut Diamond (the accepted standard for Ideal Cut Diamonds, as indicated by the prestigious American Gemological Society) will be just as beautiful and dispersive as any Hearts on Fire Diamond, which is also a true Ideal Cut Diamond.

Indeed, there is only one ACCEPTED STANDARD for TRUE Ideal Cut Diamonds.

Hearts on Fire Diamonds is not the only diamond that conforms to that standard. Rather, it is one of many "branded" and "unbranded" diamonds which conform to the same standard.

Again, thanks very much for sharing your perspective as a happy customer of HOF and enjoy your beautiful ring!

Regards,

Reality check -- Hearts on Fire diamonds are the best diamonds in the world the same way that a Louis Vuitton handbag is the "classiest" handbag in the world.

The Judah Gutwein post above hits the nail on the head. As an Accredited Senior Appraiser with the American Society of Appraisers, I see thousands of diamonds and the only difference in the HoF diamond is the brand name. Its pretty amazing to see people actually testify to "greater brilliance" etc. as it illustrates how profoundly the brain can be influenced by effective advertising. The Kaplan cut diamond was probably the template for the brand name revolution in diamonds but wise shoppers are well advised to recognize the difference between hype and substance. See and line up your ASA appraiser BEFORE you buy, get professional advice and then have the appraiser verify, validate and appraise your new treasure. Of CRITICAL importance is thet the appraiser be a THIRD PARTY and NOT an employee or affiliated with the store selling you the diamond.

Thank You! I use to, but not anymore.

Of couse HOF will take legal action against anyone using their trademarked phrase. But again, they still needed to prove to the Federal Trade Commision that their claim of having The World's Most Perfectly Cut Diamond was in fact true and accurate...what was the outcome? THEY WON! It's not just hype it's not just advertising, it's the truth.

So how many other "IDEAL" cut diamonds are cut under 100 power magnification? ZERO

I would agree that every IDEAL cut diamond sparkles tremendously, but have you ever dialed one up over 10 power magnification? I have, and you loose the IDEAL polish. Sure it looks great at 10 power but wait til you see that lizard skin or streaking or any other flaw in the polish. The PERFECT polish of a HOF diamond will show at 100 power or more.

Those other Ideal cuts also do not guarantee IDEAL symmetry or proportion higher than 10 power. HOF is the ONLY diamond that guarantees consistency in cutting and perfect polish symmetry and proportions at 100 power magnification..ten times the industry standard.

Why no answer to those truths???

Another thing I would like to stress again is that The AGS says itself that there are 15,000 different combinations of angles and if a diamond has one of those 15,000 it can still get a cut grade of ideal.

again...take a look at that crown angle on an IDEAL cut diamond. THAT IS JUST AN AVERAGE
the crown angle is not the same around the whole diameter of the diamond, as long as its average fits into the criteria for and ags IDEAl than it can still make it. With HOF diamonds, the crown angle around the entire diameter of the diamond needs to fit into the IDEAl category. I used the crown angle as an example but this also goes for every other angle on the diamond.

Hi Chuck and all:

I am starting to look ino a HoF diamond. Can any of you share with me the % discount you were able to negotiate from the list price?

Thank you.

Elaine

Elaine
There is not suppose to be any discounting on HOF. Discounting hurts the consumer in the end. All no name diamonds can be discounted and what happens is the value starts to depreciate. You pay a certain amount and then someone is going to say "Hey you could have got it cheaper if you would went to...." The more times something is discounted the more value it losses and in the end you overpaid. Take HOF for example.. if it's never discounted then you don't have to be the best shopper that finds all the "DEALS", you can go to the jeweler that you are the most comfortable with and feel confident that the price is the price. It also means that your diamond will hold it's value because it's not being discounted across the globe..ie: MOVADO! I have heard of people getting a discount off of a non HOF mounting. You pay the full price for the diamond..select a non HOF mounting and ask for a deal. Another thing, take a hard look at any retailer who is willing to discount HOF to you. They are willing to break a legal contract to uphold the pricing structure. Not only is that illegal but unethical. If I were you I wouldnt want to be a client of unethical people. How can you trust them? Seems like they are only in it for the money and most likely are unethical in other things as well.. those kind if people give jewelers a bad name and I know I wouldn't trust them for even a watch battery. P.S. Unethical people will also sometimes mark the price of a piece too high, that way they can say you are getting a discount but you're really just paying what you should be paying.

Andrea,

Thanks for getting back on this thread.

How did I know you used to sell HOF..;-):-)

Let me make two things very clear:

1. The fact that HOF can pursue legal action against any company using the trademarked HOF slogan ("World's Most Perfectly Cut Diamond"), does not require them to actually prove the veracity of their claim (to the EXCLUSION of any other Ideal cut Diamond) whatsoever.

I have no idea where you are getting your information. However, it is quite clear (ask anyone you know with a legal background) that once a company acquires a trademarked term, they have a right to protect that term by definition with no need or requirement to actually prove the claim and/or substantiate the slogan.

In addition, I fail to comprehend how you extrapolate from HOF's trademarked term and marketing, that nobody else can manufacture or sell a comparable diamond ("branded or unbranded" Ideal Cut Diamond)?? With all due respect, the fallacy of this logic is so profound that it eludes me as to how you could present this as a "fact".

Again, your assertion that the HOF slogan is "proof" of the superiority of the cut over all comparable Ideal cuts and your clear "talking points" from the days when you were selling HOF diamonds does not constitute "proof" of anything other than your commendable allegiance to the HOF brand. Moreover, the fact that you keep repeating these "talking points" does not change the clear facts on the ground, nor does it increase the veracity of your arguments.

2. Any true Ideal Cut Diamond as defined by the standard bearers of the industry for that very term, is just as "Ideal" as any HOF Ideal Cut Diamond graded by the very same laboratory!

There are no two definitions for Ideal Cut; there is only one. Any company can manufacture and submit a diamond to AGS for grading to achieve Ideal Cut status. This is not exclusive to HOF. A diamond is either an Ideal Cut diamond or it isn't. To this end, it would not matter (scientifically or visually) whether you "dialed up" a microscope to a gazzilion times magnification, the end result is still the same. The stone is either Ideal or it isn't.

Now even if we were to assume that the HOF diamond is cut to a greater degree of precision than your typical (albeit beautiful) Ideal Cut Cut diamond, which indeed (as you correctly pointed out) is calculated based upon a system of averages;

A. The trademarked slogan by HOF is not in and of itself a testament to this precision cutting....it is simply a TM slogan.

B. This would not preclude any other manufacturer of an "unbranded" diamond from creating a diamond of EXACTLY THE SAME PARAMETERS AND EXTRA PRECISION CUT AT AN ABSOLUTE FRACTION OF THE HOF PRICE.

THE FACT IS, THERE ARE DIAMONDS OUT THERE (MANY OF THEM) THAT SHARE THE SAME DEGREE OF PRECISION CUT AS THE HOF DIAMONDS AT A FRACTION OF THE PRICE.

Thus, your implication that HOF diamonds are BETTER THAN any other diamond out there (from a qualitative standpoint) is not simply opinion and conjecture...it is FACTUALLY WRONG.

Moreover, the "proofs" that you employ to substantiate this claim (HOF slogan/TM), is simply laughable.

Several people before you on this thread have alluded to the "psychological and emotional" aspect of the HOF brand (ie: the poster who compared HOF to a LV handbag..) as a means of expressing why they feel the HOF brand is "best". Truly, those are valid points and as I mentioned in the crux of this posting, this personal and subjective logic in favor of the HOF brand, is no less valid and sound than the rational/practical logic which might preclude someone from paying significantly more for the "HOF label" over an ENTIRELY COMPARABLE CUT QUALITY AND VISUALLY STUNNING unbranded Ideal cut diamond.

These are precisely the emotional/psychological vs. rational/practical considerations which I used as the very basis and foundation for this original posting.

In this regard, there is no "right or wrong" answer, just the one that works for you.

Hearts on Fire Diamonds are gorgeous diamonds with excellent brilliancy and tremendous CONSISTENCY across the board. Consumers who would willingly pay a small fortune for the psychological comfort of the "HOF Brand" over similar and beautiful unbranded diamonds for significantly less money, are absolutely vindicated.

Andrea, I very much appreciate your perspective and contributions here..and of course, you are entitled to your own opinion.

However, when you try and push the idea that the HOF diamond is "better" than any other similarly graded Ideal Cut Diamond OF EQUAL CUT PRECISION (WHICH IS NOT THE EXCLUSIVE DOMAIN, ABILITY & CAPABILITY OF HOF) and you attempt to support this assertion with your HOF "talking points" and "proofs", you are quite simply insulting our collective intelligence.

Kind Regards,

Oscar,

Great points!

Thanks.

Clearly I didnt explain myself well enough. I wasn't trying to say that because they have a trademarked phrase World's Most Perfectly Cut Diamond, thats what makes them the best.

Shortly after HOF began using this TM phrase, a few(i think it was two- maybe three) "competitors" complained to the FTC that their TM phrase was false advertising, HOF then needed to prove to the FTC that their claim of having "TWMPCD" was not false, and they won all three times. That was what I meant.

And you are 100% correct a HOF dia recieves the same grade as other ideal cuts from the AGS. But kudos to HOF for being the ONLY diamond company to consistently cut their diamonds TEN TIMES THE INDUSTRY STANDARD for an ideal.

I also suppose you are correct in that any diamond cutting company can cut TEN TIMES THE INDUSTRY STANDARD ( IF THEY HAD THE NASA DEVELOPED TELESCOPE, that allows HOF to cut to 100 power magnification or even the VIBRATION FREE CUTTING ENVIRONMENT(rolls royce aircraft engine technology), that allows them to obtain a PERFECT polish at 100 POWER MAGNIFICATION in every single diamond!)
So whom may I ask is cutting to these SAME parameters??? NO ONE

Other Ideal cut diamonds are only Ideal at 10 power HOF is the ONLY diamond that guarantees perfection at 100 POWER MAGNIFICATION. plain and simple

OOPS SORRY ABOUT THE DOUBLE SUBMISSION!

I SECOND JUDAH..GREAT POINTS OSCAR.

I ALSO BELIEVE WHAT HE SAID HOLDS TRUE TO OTHER LINES OF JEWELRY.

Andrea,

"Round and round we go"....

Balderdash, plain and simple....although I am quite impressed that (seeing as you are already out of the game) you still employ the HOF puffery and talking points with such alacrity! ;-)

Let's be honest; nobody who pays 10 times the price for a HOF diamond over an entirely comparable and equally precise Ideal cut diamond (and they DO exist), does so because HOF may be cutting at "10 times the industry standard" (unless of course all HOF customers are walking around with your "NASA developed... Rolls Royce..whatever....).

The "standard" as it were, is what determines whether a diamond is Ideal or it isn't. This standard has become the accepted and respected nomenclature for what constitutes an Ideal Cut Diamond. If cutting a loose diamond under 100 power magnification with the nifty little technology you describe, would be of ANY VISUAL, DISTINGUISHABLE and QUANTIFIABLE CONSEQUENCE, then that would quickly become the new Ideal Cut Standard.

It hasn't and methinks it wont.

Thus, when you say "other Ideal cut Diamonds are only Ideal at 10 power" you imply that these diamonds are somehow "less ideal" than a HOF diamond. This is patently untrue.

Again, you are simply insulting all savvy consumers who bothered to do the research and opted for the rational and practical satisfaction of saving a small fortune on an entirely comparable Ideal Cut Diamond over the psychological comfort of paying more for a label.

It is unfair of you to insult their intelligence this way.

Regards,

YEEEEEEE! It's fun on the merry go round!

I'm not insulting any ones intelligence, and kudos to the many people who do research before making the ever so important puchase of a diamond. I was just giving everyone a little more knlowledge and FACTS on how HOF is cutting to a higher standard. Another thing, the industry standard of grading has been around since what 1934? Maybe it's time for a change. Although that might be to fair considering HOf would then be the only Ideal cut out there, that is until the others finally caught up.

Kind of like cars in a sense. Sure there are many cars that meet the requiremnts for fuel efficency, but only a few far exceed those requirements. Why only meet the requirements? Why not be better and exceed them? rhetorical question..no need to answer

You and I can talk about the differences (or in your view no differences) between hof and other ideal cuts. But when it comes down to it NO PUFFERY included HOF is the only diamond that far exceeds the industry standard for cutting and based upon how well the brand has grown in the past 11 years, a lot of consumers are wearing those bragging rights as we speak.

Off of this subject. How about that 81 ct or so RB that sold on auction!!!??? Boy, I would love to hold it!

Judah,

Love reading your posts. It certainly is nice to read a well-written, informative entry. Thank you for all the objective views. Whose diamonds would you recommend to YOUR significant other if a diamond was to be purchased for you?

They are the only company that guarantees all facets match (pints,angles,etc.). These are the only diamonds out there that proportions are exact, not done by average's. Ex-crown angles all are 34.5 degrees, most ideal cuts can have 37,32,33,38, that equal 34 degrees on a certificate. Read the fine print, most grading done by averages even AGS. GET A SARIN REPORT. Make sure they show all facet angles, not an average. That will distinguish between that generic internet ideal cut and a higher priced Branded diamond. It's not just the name. Similar to removing the names off the front of TVs and selling them that way. Could you tell the difference between the $100 20 inch audiovox and the $1000 20 inch SONY? In the diamond industry prices are set by demand. Hearts on Fire is cut by a large diamond company, not all ideal cuts make it to the HOF collection. THe ones that do not may end up for sale as comparables on the internet for much less. They are given a new fancy Hearts and _________ name and sold for much less as comparable brands. K-MART is a brand so is TIFFANY, is there jewelry comparable in quailty and VALUE? You get what you pay for, will the Internet diamonds retain there value should you wish to trade-up? There is a HUGE demand for Hearts on Fire meaning prices and value continue to rise. ALSO, meaning that Brand will get better trade in the future. Most HOF stores trade in actual diamond value, meaning if the price goes up comparable so does the diamond you trade ineven if you paid less. Will the internet sites do that? Finally, most jewelry stores will match internet diamond prices, yet you have to play fair by paying first and they will order it for you, not the ones you see in the store. HMMM makes you wonder if prices can vary even when the certificate looks identical.

Ray,

Thanks very much for your kind words.

Personally (and just maybe because I am intimately familiar with the fact that truly beautiful diamonds are not the exclusive domain of HOF or anyone else with a"label"), I would save money and go for the most precisely cut Ideal Cut Diamond within my budget and parameters. In this process, I would only "pay" for a "brand name" if it was not associated with an additional premium just for the sake of "the name".

My purchasing decision would be rationally and practically motivated instead of emotionally/psychologically (ie: paying more for a "name") motivated.

Regards,

Bill,

You are incorrect in your presentation of certain "facts".

1. HOF is NOT the only company (or brand for that matter) that guarantees the conformity of each and every ACTUAL measurement, face, and angle to the Ideal Cut Standard. There are many other diamonds (branded and unbranded) that achieve this benchmark at a fraction of the price. There is Eightstar (TM), SuperbCert (TM), A Cut Above (TM), and on and on and on...(and those are just for the "branded" Ideal Cuts...(there are many Unbranded Ideal Cuts that conform to the same exact standard, with the same guarantees.).

2. You clearly dismiss what you call the "generic" Ideal Cut diamonds in favor of the astronomical premiums for the HOF Diamonds. Certainly that is your subjective right and preference. However, do not make the mistake of inserting this subjective argument to support the notion of any VISUAL distinction between these two beautiful Ideal Cut Diamonds. In fact, most people cannot tell the difference between a beautiful and true "generic" ideal cut diamond, vs. an ideal Cut Diamond with slightly tighter tolerances.

3. You wrote: "will the Internet diamonds retain their value should you wish to trade-up"?

Bill,

Pray tell, what is a "Internet diamond"??
Are the diamonds being sold everyday on the net, any less diamond than those being sold in the stores??

The FACT is that many Internet based diamond companies, do offer a lifetime trade up policy at the purchase price for the diamonds they sell.

And insofar as your misguided assertion re: HOF diamonds retaining their "value" better than an entirely comparable unbranded diamond, this too is subject to an equally persuasive argument to the contrary.

In fact, many people will argue that once you get past the quantifiable value of a diamond (based upon size, color, clarity and cut precision) the additional "value" of the brand name/marketing is not justified by (and commensurate with) the sometimes exorbitant premiums levied for the "label".

This is actually the reason why consumers so often will find themselves in a battle with the insurance companies (in the event of theft for a "branded diamond") to be reimbursed not just for same shape, size, color, clarity; but also for the additional "value" commanded by the "brand name label".

If this "value" as you describe were so intrinsic and JUSTIFIABLE to EVERYONE, this would never be a problem.

Thanks for your perspective.

Regards,

Bill,

Those are all very good points that should be considered in the buying process.

I presume people are familiar with the fact that most US white gold is yellow gold that is alloyed with nickel. This process creates a creamy white metal with a yellow tone. In order to get around this, the metal is then plated with Rhodium, which is a memeber of the platinum family. It also costs about three times more than platinum (so it is a rather thin plating.) Over time, depending on wear (6months- year) the rhodium will end up wearing away. Now your bright white ring that you loved so much looks more like yellow gold. I've heard stories of a lot of unhappy people. The other bad thing about using nickel in the alloying process is that people have nickel allergies. You'll end up not even being able to wear and enjoy your piece of jewelry. And yes, you can have the piece rhodium plated. But at $50 - $75 a pop, plus your time without your piece, do you really want to be doing this the rest of your life?

In europe, nickel isn't used in white gold because people are allergic to it. Since HOF sells around the world, they do not use nickel in their any of white gold jewelry. Instead, palladium which is also a member of the platinum family, is used in place of the nickel. In the end, you get a piece of jewelry that is more bright white, no need to rhodium, and less brittle. There are other US companies that are using palladiom white gold as well. If you are considering getting a piece of white gold jewelry, ask your sales associate about palladium white gold jewelry. If they can't give you any of the information that I just did, well I would run! Seriously, that means they are not well trained and you should be spending your money and trusting your important purchase with someone else.

Andrea,

Great presentation on gold.

However, what in the world does this have to do with the crux of this blog entry??

For the benefit of everyone, I ask that you please reserve your commentary to the specific topic.

Thanks!

Regards,

Folks,

I think there is an additional point which bears mentioning.

There have been those on this thread who have pointed to the psychological elements which might favor the HOF Diamond over a comparable and equally precise unbranded Ideal Cut Diamond.

Fair enough.

However, consider the following:

Assuming you found an "unbranded" automobile with the EXACT same features, functionality AND QUALITY as the Maserati at a fraction of the price and you opted for the Maserati "brand" instead, this decision would still have different EMOTIONAL/PSYCHOLOGICAL ramifications than a seemingly similar decision to purchase a HOF diamond over an unbranded diamond of equal quality.

Why?
Simple.

When you pay more for the Maserati, BMW, Cadillac, Rolls, Ferrari, Porsche, etc....EVERYONE (INCLUDING YOU, THE BUYER) CLEARLY SEES AND APPRECIATES THE DISTINCTION BETWEEN THIS CAR AND A SIMILAR QUALITY "UNBRANDED" CAR.

The unbranded car might function like a Maserati, but it sure as heck doesn't LOOK like one.

In this instance, the "brand name", logo, colors, signature hallmarks, etc. will often supersede purely qualitative considerations and is an important psychological/emotional motivator.

However, when you look at the beauty and brilliancy of a stunning Hearts on Fire Diamond and compare it side by side with the beauty and brilliancy of an equally stunning "unbranded" Ideal Cut Diamond, it is exceedingly difficult if not impossible to distinguish between these two equally brilliant diamonds.

In fact, there is at best a 50/50 statistical chance that you'd be able to successfully pick out the HOF from the 2-3-4 comparable unbranded diamonds.

Once you put down all of the HOF marketing and cannot see the HOF diamond laser inscription on the girdle, the diamond itself is simply a beautiful and brilliant diamond.

Unlike the Maserati which puts the emotional/psychological motivators on display 24/7, the HOF diamond does not.

It is no more brilliant, beautiful and scintillating than an equally precise Ideal Cut Diamond without the label.

There is nothing else that would (readily) visually identify this diamond as a Hearts on Fire Diamond. It has no special "look" or smell"...just beautiful brilliance which is equally duplicated by the many thousands of comparable Ideal Cut Diamonds being sold on the market at a fraction of the price.

Indeed, you can use the same analogy and comparison with many of the other DISTINGUISHABLE brand names like the LV handbag, HERMES belt, GUCCI shoes, etc..).

Other companies might produce a comparable product from a qualitative standpoint, but it doesn't share the same VISUAL (trademarked) HALLMARKS of the brands.

In the final analysis, does this mean there is no justification to paying more for the emotional and psychological comfort of the HOF label?

Not at all.

If it works for you, that's all that matters.

Andrea,

My "hidden involvement" as Director Of Sales & Marketing for Excel Diamonds is actually plastered all over Diamond Vues.

There is no hidden agenda and we are completely transparent about this fact as well as the fact that we sell many beautiful (Branded & Unbranded) Ideal Cut Diamonds.

This thread re: HOF Diamonds was/is presented in an objective and factual manner with an expression of many different viewpoints and perspectives.

Your last few comments have been deleted simply because you are attempting to "Hijack" this thread in a very distasteful and unprofessional manner.

I have no problems when you present your arguments and perspectives in a direct and spirited manner, even when they disagree with my own personal views, or that of anyone else.

This is all part of a good spirited debate and exchange of ideas and perspectives. I have said several times on this thread that I respect and appreciate your viewpoints. Your many postings on this thread is proof of that.

You came on and posted an unrelated entry about gold and I kindly asked you to stick to the topic at hand.

Now you have decided to focus on besmirching and belittling anyone who might disagree with your expressed viewpoint. I cannot allow this to take place on our blog.

If you cannot keep your comments, viewpoints and perspectives, germane to the topic at hand and civil to the people you are debating, I have no choice but to delete your postings and ban your IP addresses.

Kind Regards,

Great input on the Hearts on Fire diamonds, I too was stunned and impressed when I visited the jeweler and looked at them, and I was even more stunned at the price! How would I ensure that a non-HOF name brand ring is of the same brillance as a HOF ring? Do I simply ask for ideal cut? I know this is a law of averages, but I also know I probably fell victim to the 100 times magnification of the HOF diamonds and want my diamond to be as brilliant but not as much of a hit to the pocketbook? Suggestions on talking points at the jewelers? Thanks for all the great input!

I recently bought a HOF diamond after looking at many others in the store. The price was certainly higher but I could not get over how much more they shone than average diamonds. I have no idea whether I was duped my marketing or not at the end of the day it doesn't matter. I'm happy with the purchase and feel I hav value for money.

Danielle,

Ask for an AGS Certified (American Gemological Society) Ideal Cut Diamond (you will see the Ideal designations on the report). This diamond will be on par (visually) with any Hearts on Fire Diamond.

Best of luck!

Jill,

Thanks for sharing and please enjoy your beautiful Hearts on Fire Diamond!

Best Regards,

Get real, folks. If you were a company that sold something that is essentially a commodity (diamond, granite, quartz, steel), you would get together with your marketing department and decide how will we give the appearance of the most added value, or shall I say, perceived value? Do you think the HoF diamond is 20% costlier to manufacture and therefore 20% more expensive? HoF is genius at adding a little value to the diamond and then enormously increasing their profit. You want fries with that? Or, how about the clearcoat? Suckers.

My friend is all ga-ga about these Hearts on fire diamonds.Pardon my ignorance, but here's some questions:
1) Do all "ideal" cut diamonds show the hearts & arrows pattern, & if not, what makes it appear? Another special cut?
2) If you can only see the hearts & arrows pattern when the stone is upside down, why get it,since the stone won't be mounted that way? Just for your inside knowledge that the pattern is there? Or does it have more sparkle than a regular "ideal" cut? (which are pretty awesome...)
3) Is there a difference between Hearts on fire diamonds & ones being sold as hearts & arrows?
Thanks for your time,
Bee

Judah? Anyone?
Bee

my husband and i have just puchased the vivacious ring from the hearts of fire collection . We had been to a couple of shops and one of the sales assistance showed us part of the collection and we purchasd the above ring. I have been stopped many times by many people admirng my ring saying they have never seen a ring shine so much this says it all we have been married for 1o years and my original ring was 1ct platinum single stone also a very good diamond but nothing like hearts of fire

Let's be serious everyone. I am well entrenched in the diamond manufacturing world. I have been so for years. All HOF is is a spectacular job of psychological marketing....period! In fact, the true ideal cut diamond was designed in 1919 by Marcel Tolkowsky. Almost 100 years later, it remains the benchmark of the industry. The HOF diamond is a simple ideal cut diamond based on Marcel Tolkowsky's parameters.. All of this jazz about 100 times magnification, NASA telescopes, yada yada is just pure bull. It's a brilliant selling ploy to make you think you are seeing something you are not. If I put 2 ideal cut hearts and arrows diamonds next to each other, one being HOF and the other a Tolkowsky idea, you would not tell the difference. They manufacture their diamonds like every other ideal cut diamond manufacturer. In fact, I am willing to bet they do not even manufacture all of their stones. They most likely outsource some of their supply in the open trading market. I read earlier that someone thought it was better value in the resale world if it were HOF. That is completely wrong! In fact, if an HOF customer were to try and resell their diamond, they would get absolutely hammered in the secondary market. Just as if someone were to buy a stone from Tiffany. A diamond is a diamond. They are a true commodity today. Yes, ideal cuts will yield a better result and are worth more, but the stone being HOF means absolutely nothing! Don't fool yourselves! You are all smarter than that!

I think hearts on fire are special no matter what anyone says. I just got engaged and my boyfriend got me a hearts on fire and it is so bright it is great. So is it better who knows but I think it all depends on the person. Pennie

The vitriol on this site is waaaay out of hand. Currently considering a ring or earrings for wife and have to say, perhaps the industry standard needs some updating. Too many rings "certified" by the "gemologists" simply don't measure up to the "new standard" which is HOF. Real issue is how fast the technology to make these cuts is disseminated in the industry. By the tone and tenor of the insider replies, I'd say HOF folks have locked up the supply for at least a few years.

James,
There is no "new" standard. Don't try and convince yourself of something that is not. The reason the salespeople push HOF so hard is that they get paid every time they make a presentation to a customer BY HOF. If they actually make a sale, the salesperson gets more $$. It is all a game. It is not that the salespeople believe the stone is any better, it is all $$ driven. HOF spends a fortune on the push of their product, hence why it is so expensive. Th stone isn't worth more, it just costs HOF more because of all of this, hence they have to sell it for more.
Save yourself the $$. If you want an ideal cut, by all means you should buy one. They truly are the brightest diamond. I highly suggest that you do not pay twice what the stone is worth. You should go to a store and ask for a GIA EX EX EX stone. The table % should be between 53-57 and the depth should be 58.5 - 62.9. You want ex polish and ex symmetry. If you have those things, then the rest will take care of itself. No way should you pay $20k when you can get the same exact stone for $10k. The only difference is, it does not have a fancy purple box with the HOF name. WASTE OF HARD EARNED MONEY......

I think hearts on fire are special no matter what anyone says. I just got engaged and my boyfriend got me a hearts on fire and it is so bright it is great. So is it better who knows but I think it all depends on the person. Pennie

sheeple! This is why they can ask 20% premiums.

Sorry folks. 2 stones of equal clarity with the exact same cutlet angle, table, pavillion, girdle etc equally polished...one HOF the other brad X..NOONE will tell them apart. 37% on a HOF is 37% on brand X.

I feel for the uninformed boob out their...HOF may be a good choice. You WILL get a great stone every time and you WILL pay a premium for your ignorance.

For those of us that have experience looking at stones we can cherry pick and get a equal stone for a fraction of the cost.

HOF, Hearts and Arrows, eightstar....great stones/marketing.

Here's some data supporting the touchy-feely side of the arguement:

Study: $90 wine tastes better than the same wine at $10

Hello all, my boyfriend and I have been ring shopping at dozens of stores for a couple weeks now, and I can safely say I haven't seen a single ring in the style I liked with the same brilliancy as an HOF ring.I am not just talking about the center stone - I wanted to have diamonds along the band as well. I must have seen a hundred rings in the exact style I wanted, but often the side diamonds were dull. In the HOF ring I saw, every single diamond sparkled - it was just the effect I had been searching for and had not found. But I do not want to break my boyfriend's bank, so to speak. If there are any comparable diamonds at a fraction of the price, where can I start shopping for them? I would rather not purchase online. I am in the Chicago area - are there any stores that sell comparable diamonds without the HOF brand name? I've seen other ideal diamond cuts and they did not have the same brilliance.

One thing I did notice. When I looked at an ideal diamond and an HOF diamond straight on, they both looked brilliant. But many times you do not look at a diamond straight on; many times it is from the side. The HOF seemed to have a better brilliancy from all angles than the others I have seen in the stores. It seemed to 'come alive', and I have never ever seen another diamond do that.

If there is a better deal, please point me in the right direction. I don't mean 'ask for an ideal cut', because I've seen them. It seems like there are a few people here who know something about diamonds, so surely SOMEONE would know a brand or SOMETHING. I don't care about the HOF brand name, I just want comparable quality of the type I have seen there.

One other thing I forgot to mention, but I think it is important. Every single store that sold HOF rings had a sales representative who really seemed ecstatic about the rings. Because I felt that the sales associates loved and preferred the HOF rings, because they seemed captivated by the brilliance themselves, it made me take notice. I want to be left alone when I am looking at rings, because as another person mentioned, I WAS put in mind of used car salesmen. I have so recently experienced so many other stores and salespeople, and NONE of them seemed to really be excited about what they were selling. Whatever the hype is about the ring, the people selling them sure seem to believe it, and if they are seeing all kinds of different diamonds every day and are still excited about HOF, that says something. I'm recognized in my daily and professional life as being intuitive about emotion, and I think I would have picked up on it if it were a sales tactic, having seen that before.

mmspaulding,

I'd like to address 3 of your observations:

1. If you saw "better brilliancy" in the HOF diamonds from "the sides of the stone", this is a mistake. "Brilliance" which emanates from the sides (pavilion) of a diamond is actually indicative of light leakage, or the opposite of brilliance...not a good thing. Perhaps you were "seeing" the result of the trick lighting in the overhead (high intensity) Halogen bulbs?

2. Don't mistake the enthusiasm of the salespeople for promoting HOF diamonds as a result of its superior beauty over an entirely comparable ideal cut stone. Sure they believe in the brand, since indeed it is a beautiful stone with an excellent and supportive marketing machine behind it. However, clearly the reason they are so excited to sell the HOF diamond, is simply because they make a bloody fortune off the sale of a HOF diamond. The profit on these stones is by FAR in excess of their profit margins on any other diamond in their showcase. Of course the opportunity to make a super profit, would make anyone "super excited"!

3. Any GIA certified EX/EX Haerts and Arrows Diamond, or an AGS certified triple Ideal cut diamond, will be comparable to a similarly graded HOF diamond at an absolute fraction of the price.

End of story.

Knowledge is power.

All I know is I did my research, had the ideal ranges (AGS ranges as I recall, although I know those are not the only ones...) in front of me as I searched for the perfect stone in a reasonable price range. By the numbers alone, I chose a stone from Blue Nile - not their Signature Ideal because I don't give a flip about color - but a lovely warm J color Ideal. The stone I was sent was absolutely stunning, a TIC (Tolkowski Ideal Cut) when I ran it through the HCA online tool. AND, not that it particularly matters, it's a H&A too.

I too have seen the HoF diamonds. They ARE stunning, but I'd bet some serious money that if mine sat side by side with theirs in a jeweler's case, under the lights, on that black velvet of theirs, you couldn't tell the difference.

BTW - Does anyone know what exactly their take on ideal translates to when it comes to the numbers? I was trying to find what ranges they cut them to, what their diamond cutting standards are, but could not find those numbers on their site, which pretty much annoyed the crap out of me.

I've read all of the comments here and I was curious if you can still see the hearts from the bottom of the diamond on a diamond thats NOT AN HOF.

Thank You

Richard,

If it is a true hearts & arrows diamond and it is still in its loose (unmounted) condition, you will be able to see the crisp hearts and arrows pattern with a H&A viewer. Same for HOF.

Regards,

So are the hearts and arrows pattern gone forever once the diamond is mounted? I went to a jewelers the other day and saw the HOF and was amazed. The salesman got me sold when he told me they use some type of patent technology that absorbs the vibration while the machine
that cuts the diamond is going 6000rpm, work under 100x the magnification (10x industries standards), and how I can see the hearts and arrows from under the diamond.

I'm not trying to go around in circles but isn't it possible to look at another non-brand diamond with an ideal cut and see imperfection if those diamonds are seen under 100x the magnification?

I am not pro HOF, rather, just someone who is about to buy a diamond ring and doesn't want to over pay just for the name.

Thank You

A TRUE HEARTS AND ARROWS DIAMOND WILL HAVE THE EXACT SAME PATTERN AS ANY HOF, PERIOD.

I am overwhelmed by all of this. We have been looking for wedding rings for over 2 months. We just don't want to get ripped off due to lack of knowledge. Most jewelry stores just want you to "lay down" and buy on the spot--they don't want to educate you. I finally found a salesperson who took the time to educate me. Between her info and going online, I think my fiance and I will be just fine. We will not go for the HOF but with a H&A.

The only reason HOF salespeople are so enthusiastic is because the HOF company gives a bonus to any salesperson who even makes a presentation to a customer let alone a sale. If they happen to make a sale, they get even more. It is called a spiff.... Salespeople in jlry stores don't make much money, so they look at this as an opportunity to make as much extra money as possible. The dew is slowly coming off the lilly for this diamond brand. Jewelers this Christmas experienced a tough time selling the product due to the extremely high pricing. It had it's glory in the past couple of years, but it is slowly unraveling for the company. That is why you see much more fashion jlry in stores as opposed to straight engagement rings. It is too hard for them to sell. People don't want to pay the price, so they decided to mass produce the product in chachky jewelry. Their vaults are quickly becoming filled with defunct styling and leftovers. The fashion business is very tough and ultimately becomes a killer. The quality of the mountings is compromised and the diamond quality is slipping. Just some interesting info...

Thanks for your input guys. I ended up buying another Ideal Ideal .50 carat diamond from Jared's. Not sure if I over spent but the one I bought cost 2200 when the HOF wanted 3200. I'll take the $1000 savings for the same quality any day.

Thanks Again

Thanks Richard,

I will have to say that Jared does have a great selection of Ideal Cut diamonds. I recently visited the store and found their Peerless Collection to be Excellent Polish, Excellent Symmetry w/ a light analysis as well as very informative certificate info. I have enjoyed all of the postings and have gained much insight. So THANKS TO ALL. I belive I will stick w/ Jared and their Peerless collection. .78 carat, ideal, ideal, excellent polish, excellent symmetry, VS2, E $4000.00. Think it is worth it? I would love some feedback. They don't seem to willing to budge on the price, but we'll see when I play hardball. Any insignt would be helpful. Off the subject but is palladium coating on white gold that much better? Jared will re-rhodium for lifetime, but not having to bother with it would be nice. Any imput?

Thanks again to all!

Just go into a jeweler who carries HOF and look at two "equal" diamonds (one HOF, the other un-branded) under 10x magnification then 60x (what many jewelers have). You will see the HOF difference. Any average person like me can really see the difference under the high power. It will end this stupid fighting.

Cara,

1. Nobody is "fighting". This is a simply spirited debate with different viewpoints.

2. There will be no difference between a HOF Diamond and a similar quality hearts and arrows diamond under ANY level of magnification...don't kid yourself.

Besides, do you actually walk around with a 60X magnified loupe to view beautiful diamond engagement rings on womens fingers? I know if anybody got that close to our engagement ring, I'd probably have them arrested!!

Thanks for your input.

My Fiance purchased a hearts on fire 1.03C diamond with a wrap of blue diamond marquis and smaller hearts on fire diamonds. He wanted a 'wow' ring and that is exactly what he got. The number of people who have noticed this piece and commented on it is unbelievable. I travel extensively and no matter where i am it is noticed. Even in Las Vegas where they are used to bling...it stood out.

I dont know all the in's and out's of diamonds, but what i do know is that, after 38 yrs of being with this man, this diamond arrangement is the WOW factor he was looking for...and THAT is what counts. I look at that ring everyday and it makes me smile each and everytime i do. comments made about no difference between HOF and similar quality come from those that handle the 'similar quality' in my opinion...not from those that 'care'.

We will definitely be looking for HOF for our wedding bands.

Did Zales ever sell HOF diamonds? I Bought my wife an engagement ring there (in Bakersfield Ca.) and they said it was a "hearts on fire diamond" I thinks the paperwork even has it on there. I did not know HOF was a brand name. They made it seem like it was exclusive to Zales. I will look into this more when I get back from Iraq. But if anyone has any input I would appriciate it. Thank You.

Cheryl,

Thanks very much for your input.

You are no less correct than anything that has been written here.

You bought into the HOF diamond brand, choosing to go with your heart and that's all that matters.

You got an absolutely beautiful ring and didn't mind paying a premium for it.

Indeed you are vindicated!

Still, that doesn't mean that the many thousands of consumers (an every growing segment of the marketplace, BTW) who do the research and find that they can spend a fraction of the price of any HOF diamond for an entirely comparable diamond without the sticker, are no less vindicated than you are.

Some people buy with their Hearts, others with their heads.

Both of you are correct, since buying a diamond always involves the synergy between rational/practical vs. emotional/psychological considerations.

Thanks very much!

Kind regards,

Hi Everyone,

Thankyou, I've really enjoyed reading this debate thought it left me a little worried initially. So I thought I'd chip in.

Today my fiancée and I finally bought our engagement rings, mine being a HOF.
It was kind of a spur of the moment decision. After almost 3 months of looking and rings, and considering custom makes, we half heartedly walked into a jewellery store I used to work at and ... it all sort of happened.

I'm not stranger to diamonds, previously working in the jewellery retail industry for over 7 years. Hearts on Fire have not been hugely marketed here so I didn't know too much about them except for vague recognition of the name. Safe to say, I wasn't actively looking for a HOF.

The fact of the matter is that it wasn't just the brilliance of the stone that made me make the jump, but the over all design and style of the ring. I'm generally quite hard to please with jewellery, but this was ring was so unique and different to what I’ve seen before and in the end ... so me.
That made all the difference. I also have to say that we didn't pay through the nose for it. It was right in our price range (which wasn't extraordinary by the way)

Sure I could have gone through the process of buying the stones some place else and then having the design mimicked and custom made by a jeweller. It would have cost less, really for the same ring. But what would happen to that moment when I put it on and it took my breath and I said "that's the one!"

Trust me after years of surreptitiously rolling my eyes at crying brides-to-be, I'm not a sappy rose-spectacled romantic but rather a pragmatist. Still, I wouldn't trade that moment for anything.

I hope this post will settle the worries of people who have bought a HOF to later find out that they might have overpaid. If you didn't put yourself in debt over it, and you have a wonderful memory, a happy glow and at the end of the day, still a damn good diamond ... who cares?

Judah,
Thank you for moderating this discussion board, it really was informative (although hard to follow a very long trail...)

There seems to be 2 different school of thoughts being discussed and argued. (1st) pure materialistic view: A diamond is a diamond... and (2nd) "Value" of a brandname.

This arguent can not be won, since both views are correct. 2 diamonds cut to same specs will be undistinguishable since it is a commodity. At the same time, you can not deny the fact of BrendName satisfaction. There is also a little problem of Jewerly retailing. Most of us without deep knowledge of geomology get hammered in the Jewerly store by all the flashes and salesmanship. At the end all we (consumers) want is a good quality stone that our significant others will love. A brand name commence a primium for a guarantee of quality. That's it. WE are never presented with a case of 2 ideal cut diamonds of perfectly matching specs and different price. We are being subjected to a master salesmanship. And brand names actually do help us (if you can afford it). So in an idealistic set up nobody would pay for brend name, but we do not live or buy in an idealistic setting...
Hope this helps

I own a Hearts on Fire Diamond ring. Color is a J, clarity is VS2 and it is a 1.98 carat round stone. I also own eight other smaller HOF rounds set in gold. Is it worth the money? Absolutely! They sparkle in the dark! If you are going to invest in diamonds you want them to maintain value. If you bury a new Honda, as soon as you drive it off the lot it has significantly decreased in value and will not hold its value over time. If you purchase a large diamond at a retail chain store, as soon as you walk away with your stone, there is no lifetime return policy. Why? Because other diamonds have to be marked up significantly for profit and if you try to resale that diamon you will lose out. Most HOF jewelers will buy back the diamond at any time for the purchase price minus tax, this is because they not only hold value but increase over time. A mercedes on the other hand purchased at the same time of equal value will hold its value longer. There is a lot in a name for a reason. Quality!!! A lot of brand names are fluff but if you are going to drop $20,000.00 on a stone.....make it a HOF, the resale (if you could ever part with it) is in your favor.

A Happy HOF owner

Lisa Burch

Lisa,

Thanks very much for chiming in here!
Your happiness is warranted and commendable, even as your presentation of certain "facts" are erroneous.

Hearts On Fire diamonds maintain their "value" only with respect to other HOF diamonds which command the same exorbitant premiums. Thus, if you ever wanted to sell a HOF diamond, you would be forced to sell it to a person/or jeweler who is looking for and willing to pay a small fortune for a HOF diamond specifically (very small percentage of the overall market). In addition, you'd have a tough time even within this limited framework since most people would rather pay the same price for a HOF diamond that nobody has ever worn....I know I would..;-)

Conversely, equally beautiful and precisely cut diamonds without the brand name will appeal to a far greater segment of the market place in the event of a re-sale and would absolutely hold its original value (or increase in value the same way) relative to the purchase price.

If anything, you'd probably make a better profit on an unbranded ideal diamond in a resale just because you didn't pay so much for it in the first place.

Many stores offer the same buy back / upgrade policies for their unbranded ideals same as HOF. No self respecting jeweler would have any "less confidence" in his ability to sell an equally beautiful unbranded stone. Sure, he may not make the same astronomical profit as he would with a HOF diamond, but at the same time his cost/expense/profit ratio on the unbranded stone and relative to his bigger market pool, more than compensates for the slack. If this weren't the case, no jeweler would offer anything other than HOF diamonds, much less an upgrade or buy back policy....

In the final analysis, a hugely expensive HOF diamond does not maintain its "value" anymore than an equally beautiful and precisely cut diamond for a fraction of the price.

Enjoy your beautiful jewelry!

Kind Regards,

From what I gather Blue Nile's "signature ideal" collection would be identical in cut to Hearts on Fire (and less expensive?). On the website they show that their signature diamonds all have the "hearts and arrows" effect while the "ideal" ones almost have hearts and arrows but they are not perfectly symmetrical. It would be nice to be able to see a Signature Ideal diamond next to an "Ideal" diamond to see the difference.

Judah, I like how you removed the one person, Andrea, from this discussion who was actually adding value & facts. I'm the last guy who wants to pay more for the same thing, but your arguments are unconvincing. If you are so sure that Hearts on Fire diamonds are the equal to other "ideal" cut diamonds, then why did you pose the question in the first place?

Judah,

Just curios you keep mentioning these other diamonds that compare to hof diamonds. I would like to know where these diamonds can be found. i think your full of it. name some names who sells these diamonds that compare where can they be found. you keep saying they are out there but wont say where. we can all find the HOF diamond but you seem to be the ony one who can find these other perfect diamonds that are made byy someone else.

Ryan,

Sure thing...glad you asked..and that's pretty easy!

Simply go into one of the millions of diamond and jewelry stores across the United States and beyond and ask for a GIA (Gemological Institute of America) certified EX/EX (Polish/Symmetry)diamond with an Excellent Cut grade indicated (on the certificate)! These diamonds are not made "by someone else". They are manufactured by thousands of cutting facilities all over the world. These are called "Ideal Cut Diamonds" (same as any HOF "Ideal Cut Diamond" which achieves THE EXACT SAME grade).

Perhaps you want a diamond certified by the other foremost Authority in Gemology (AGS-American Gemological Institute)??

No problem!

Follow same instructions as above and ask for an AGS Certified Diamond with an Ideal Cut Grade (also indicated on the certificate).

Regards,

I have been looking for a new diamond wedding ring for my 15th anniversary (coming up in Sept) for over a year. Three months ago my husband and I were shown a HOF diamond, we were both amazed but being "savvy" shoppers we knew we could get the same quality diamond at a better price. WRONG!!! If they are out there, we have not seen them. I was very willing to go with a less expensive diamond, but my HUSBAND is the one who keeps saying "their are none as beautiful as the HOF" - and I believe he is right. So Judah, I know this post will make you furious, but in all honesty I have not seen with my eyes any diamond as beautiful as the HOF. Do you have a negative history with HOF or something? I dont understand the hostility in your posts.

Yes HOF Diamonds get the same grade as any GIA triple excellent and any AGS triple Ideal, but the FACT of the matter is that that is only because the diamond's grades are given at 10x magnification. That standard of diamond grading has been around since..oh..say the early 1930's. Now think about the computer you are using right now or the car, cellphone t.v., and any of the many other luxuries we have- Where would we be at right now if the technology didn't keep up with the times? HOF is going above and beyond the standard that was created over 70 years ago and are cutting at 100X magnification and making sure that ALL the angles are correct (not just the first 17 like other diamonds because thats all the laboratories check) also making sure that all of the facets are perfectly polished at 100x! Now how many of those AGS Triple Zero and GIA Triple Excellents would actually make the grade if the standards were higher? NONE! Do HOF diamonds cost more? Sure they do! They are cut to a higher standard than any other diamond and they cut their diamonds CONSISTENTLY each and every time, so you can feel confident in the brand and you'll know what you are getting. Now Judah, When another diamond is CONSISTENTLY cut and polished at 100x magnification using the same technology as the huble space telescope and polished on a vibration free cutting environment, also making sure that ALL of the facet's angles are "ideal", then, and only then, can you truthfully say that any GIA TRIPLE EXCELLENT or AGS TRIPLE ZERO are the same thing as a HOF.

R.J.

Your own points can be viewed (and indeed are viewed by many inside and outside of the diamond industry) in the exactly opposite manner

If GIA or AGS labs (the two foremost Gemological Laboratories in the world who are at THE CUTTING EDGE of evolving cut research etc.)saw any obvious and consistent VISUAL difference as a result of the HOF cutting methods, they would have adjusted the Ideal Cut standard to reflect this new "standard".

The fact is, there isn't and they haven't.

Let us all know the next time you see someone viewing a Hearts on Fire diamond engagement ring to observe the HOF cutting edge through the "Huble space telescope".

I'm sure all the readers here would love to "see it".....;-)

Hmm? WellLevi i posted an informative post but it somehow was deleted. Imagine that

Wow, you must be very high up in the food chain at the GIA or AGS for you to know exactly how they run their laboratories- or how/why they do or do not make changes.

I never stated that people would be walking around with the huble space telescope to look at their diamonds, but thanks for the sarcasm. I only said that HOF cuts and polishes their diamonds at 100X magnification using that technology.

Just because people are not using this technology to look at their diamonds does not mean it isn't important. When light goes to enter a diamond and hits those polish lines or lizards skin (that can be seen on an AGS Ideal or GIA excellent cut diamond by using a Standard grading microscope at anything above ten power), the light will never make it inside of the diamond or back out to the viewers eye.

I love owning a HOF diamond because I know that I have a diamond that was cut to a higher standard than any other diamond. My diamond was cut by a company that looks towards the future and is continually increasing their technology instead of just trying to MEET the standards in the diamond industry- they surpass them.

Again, I had to repost this entry because it was deleted. Hopefully by error since I am following the topic and adding much value to this disscusion.

The fact of the matter is the perfection of the cut. All other diamonds in the industry are merely cut based on averages ( the crown angles, table, depth, etc)
Even the polish that hearts on fire finishes the diamond with is absolutely remarkable. Keep in mind that the higher amount of light absorbtion requires the highest amount of polish.
The value aspect of the HOF is worth its weight in gold. They are the only diamonds in the industry that continue to increase in value where as your "generic" diamonds will decrease in value.
If you want to get a bargain on a diamond, go to blue nile or costco. If you want the best, go out and get a HOF diamond. One thing is for sure your wife will continue to appreciate the brilliance and all the compliments continuously recieved by all her critics (her friends, her sister, her co-workers)
Start your futre investment(wife) with a good investment (HOF)

R.J.

I assure you your earlier comments were not deleted (perhaps you didn't hit the "post" button) and I'm glad you reposted.

You are adding much value to this discussion, thanks.

Brian,

Thanks for your perspective.

One of my good friends of over 10 years owns his own jewelry store, went to a top notch gemology school, is also an award winning jewelry designer and the only jeweler I truly trust (I knew him in high school before he started any of this). He sells HOF in his store and I've never heard anyone back a brand so much. Before my fiance bought my ring, I flat out asked my friend if HOF is really "that much better" and his response over IM was simply, "YES!" We were lucky to get my stone at cost so I know he wasn't just saying that to make a profit off of us. I say, go big or go home. If you plan to wear the diamond for the rest of your life, get a HOF. I've never seen a diamond "come to life" like my HOF does -- no regrets at all with our choice!

I think RJ touched on something that is a BIG part of what HOF is. It is not just an ideal cut diamond, but it is a branded diamond. We live in a world where everything is branded. Given that, what having something "branded" means is often forgotten. The purchase of a branded item over a non-branded item is favored in society because of the consistent guarantee of quality that brand gives a person. Why does one purchase Campbell’s soup over a store’s generic label soup? Because the buyer knows the quality he can expect from Campbell’s, the generic requires research to determine quality.

The same holds true for ideal cut diamonds. You can walk into a jeweler and ask for an AGS triple zero diamond with perfect polish and symmetry, and then request a Saran report to guarantee that the angles all match and that averages are not pulling that diamond into the ideal cut ranges. However, that's a lot of work for the average consumer, and even the average jeweler. The HOF brand guarantees that the diamond has all of those qualities, with all the certifications to prove it. Simple. How much is piece of mind worth? I found it to be worth the price difference, and I will only get HOF for my wife because I know every diamond, whether it is an engagement ring, diamond studs, or her wedding band, are all perfectly cut. Every person has to decide if that guarantee is worth anything to them.